May 12, 2022

Are Monorepos and NFTs Worth It?

Do you use monorepos? Do you love NFTs named after dogs? Chuck and Robbie have mixed feelings on both monorepus and Shiba Inu tokens and they’re probably not the only ones conflicted. Developer tools and the metaverse are complex topics that don’t always yield solidly positive or negative results. 

The beauty of our ever-evolving digital space is the ability to continually iterate and learn from what’s not working. Having said that, just because something is new (and trending on Twitter) doesn’t mean it’s the best tool for the job, nor that it should be used for anything besides its original purpose. Between monorepos and digital coins, sometimes the hype outweighs the benefit. 

In this episode, Chuck and Robbie discuss their thoughts on monorepos, the downside to trending languages and developer tools, why the metaverse should be approached with caution, plus a whatnot covering everything under the sun. 


Key Takeaways

  • [01:22] - A brief whatnot on SNOOs and Robbie’s status as a new parent.
  • [02:55] - A whiskey review.
  • [12:29] - Why Robbie can’t wrap his head around monorepos. 
  • [28:20] - Why Robbie is (semi) entrenched in the metaverse. 
  • [34:21] - Chuck and Robbie’s take on the Oscar slap and the future of comedy.
  • [37:16] - A less serious whatnot about podcasts, electric cars, entertainment, and new babies. 



[21:43] - “I think that there’s good practice in saying ‘why?’ But I don’t think everything should always be one way. I think that [you should] just use the best tool for the job when you come across that.” ~ @CharlesWthe3rd

[22:04] - “There are cases where monorepo could work and be good for people. I’m not saying they suck all the time. It’s my argument with everything — people use React because they think it’s cool, people use TypeScript because they think it’s the hotness, we need to type everything. Monorepos are cool because some guy said, ‘hey these are cool.’ If it’s not solving a real problem for you, just remove that from the code.” ~ @rwwagner90

[31:31] - “I still believe in the utility of the technology [of NFTs]. I do believe that there’s something there. And people are just going to get more clever in the way that they apply that and there will be more security down the line. There’s just way too many rug pulls these days to really make it all worth something.” ~ @CharlesWthe3rd




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Robbie Wagner: [00:09] What's going on, everybody? Welcome to another Whiskey Web and Whatnot with myself, Robbie Wagner, and my co-host, as always, Charles William Carpenter III.
Chuck Carpenter: [00:21] You can't seem to get the other two on this show, so settle for III.
Robbie Wagner: [00:29] The other two want to be on the show?
Chuck Carpenter: [00:31] Well, it would be difficult for at least for one.
Robbie Wagner: [00:34] Yeah.
Chuck Carpenter: [00:34] Yeah. There would be some digging involved.
Robbie Wagner: [00:39] Yeah.
Chuck Carpenter: [00:40] And then for the other, there would be an awkward 20-year-later call. So probably not. We'll try to skip those.
Robbie Wagner: [00:48] Yeah, fair enough. Well, we'll settle for III, and yeah today we don't really have an agenda written down. I think the last episode we did was a few weeks ago, and it was similar. Like, I don't think we just kind of shot the shit and whatever, but we're doing that again because, whatever, it doesn't matter.
Chuck Carpenter: [01:07] That's the heart and soul of this show. We can't take ourselves too seriously. Having billionaires and famous tech people on all the time. Sometimes you just have to listen to us. Non-billionaires and non-famous tech people.
Robbie Wagner: [01:21] Yeah. We have normal problems. Loans and debt and all that stuff.
Chuck Carpenter: [01:26] And children.
Robbie Wagner: [01:27] Yes. Yes. Now I have a child. Finn is, let's see, a week and however many days. Let's say a week and a half.
Chuck Carpenter: [01:36] Yeah.
Robbie Wagner: [01:36] Old.
Chuck Carpenter: [01:37] That's the last time you slept was a week and a half ago.
Robbie Wagner: [01:39] Well, it hasn't been too bad. I guess we can start with a brief whatnot on this here. So we have the Snoo. I don't know if you've heard of that, but it's like this bassinet that kind of, like, moves back and forth and makes noise and he sleeps all night. Like, we have to wake him up to feed him like we're supposed to, but he doesn't wake us up.
Chuck Carpenter: [02:03] Oh, wow. I suddenly dislike you. I want others to experience pain. It's a strange thing in parenting, you know, you're like, this was terrible. I hope it's not good for you either.
Robbie Wagner: [02:16] Yeah, no, I mean, there has been some pain. Like, before we got home from the hospital, there was lots of pain because I had to just basically walk back and forth in the hospital room with him all night. He would maybe sleep, like, 30 minutes and then be like, hey, you're not holding me. What are you doing?
Chuck Carpenter: [02:34] Right.
Robbie Wagner: [02:35] I've been peed on, I think, six or seven times now.
Chuck Carpenter: [02:39] Wow.
Robbie Wagner: [02:39] In a week and a half.
Chuck Carpenter: [02:40] Okay.
Robbie Wagner: [02:41] I'm learning, though.
Chuck Carpenter: [02:42] Yeah. Let's put a pin in a couple of these things. Sure. Because you got to have all the things. So I will ask about solving that problem here in a bit. Okay. I'm going to save it because here we are. All right. So today starting with this.
Robbie Wagner: [02:57] Yeah.
Chuck Carpenter: [02:57] Let's start with this very nice whiskey and celebration of your fatherhood Calumet Farm. This is their twelve-year single rack black. Know what that means? 47, 94 proof. The mash bill is luckily, they put this all in the bottle for me. 74% corn. Have another rye, 18%, and malted barley, 8%. And this is a Bardstown distillery, so it's the heart and soul of it right there. Seems good. I've had one other Calumet farms.
Robbie Wagner: [03:30] I didn't even realize that this was a twelve year. Like, this is some decent stuff.
Chuck Carpenter: [03:36] Yeah, I'm pretty hopeful for this. I've tried one other Calumet. It was a 14-year, actually.
Robbie Wagner: [03:43] I've ruined it with a large ice cube, as per ushe. I mean, I'm on paternity leave, so I'm drinking it as I want. We'll be official again later.
Chuck Carpenter: [03:55] Is that a fancy Norlan Rauk's glass?
Robbie Wagner: [03:58] Mhm.
Chuck Carpenter: [03:58] Wow.
Robbie Wagner: [03:59] They call it, like, the heavy Rauk tumbler or something. It is extremely heavy. It's like a pound or more. Like super heavy.
Chuck Carpenter: [04:09] I'm chewing my whiskey so that I get that first bit over with. I should get some of those since these are, like, feather lights. I feel like I'm going to crush them in my hands at some point. Right now I'm going to take a real drink.
Robbie Wagner: [04:23] Yeah. Once again, I don't have any real flavor notes quite yet, but it's tasty.
Chuck Carpenter: [04:31] I should have smelled it before I tasted it. I have that problem sometimes because then the tastes start to affect my thoughts and the smell because I feel like I'm tasting a little bit of, like, orange rind in there. Yeah, little orange rind. A little nutmeggy, and then some leather.
Robbie Wagner:[04:51] I feel like I'm getting some cherry. And I've never eaten straight wheat, but, like, kind of the smell of wheat in a flavor.
Chuck Carpenter: [05:01] Okay. Interesting, since there's no wheat in this one.
Robbie Wagner: [05:04] Well, I mean, maybe it comes from the wood somehow.
Chuck Carpenter: [05:07] I don't know if I've ever had, like, raw wheat. I've had, like, some raw grains before, though. Like barley or whatever. Like roasted barley. When you go to the Guinness Distillery, they'll let you taste some of their roasted barley. It's kind of chocolatey, actually.
Robbie Wagner: [05:25] Interesting. Yeah. I don't have a lot to say flavor-wise other than that, like, tastes kind of like a normal bourbon. It's pretty smooth. Definitely been aged a while. So that probably leads to the smoothness.
Chuck Carpenter: [05:41] Yes. In your scientific opinion. Yeah, I'd say. I'm not getting a lot of range and diversity out of it, though. Like, I really am getting so much of this orange rind, kind of a little bit of spice, and then kind of finishes with this leathery, old leather belt. Like an old leather belt if you smell that. That's kind of what I feel like I'm tasting.
Robbie Wagner: [06:07] Yeah. I mean, it's kind of classic Urbany, depending on how crazy the distiller wants to get. Are usually pretty mild. Like, it's bourbon flavored. It's not like a rye. Has a lot of other flavors going on, but bourbon is just, like, I've got a lot of corn. I'm, like, kind of sweet. Not that it's bad.
Chuck Carpenter: [06:28] It might burn a little bit. It depends. Oh, no, I think this twelve-year mellows a lot of the burn actually being high corn, and then twelve-year, I think it kind of makes it smooth.
Robbie Wagner: [06:39] Yeah.
Chuck Carpenter: [06:40] So I could see this as being, like a pretty decent, easy sipper. I don't remember how much it was, but it feels fancy. Like, the bottle shape is nice. It's like squatty, but kind of thin and oblong. It's almost like what is that, like, Louis XIII? Expensive.
Robbie Wagner: [07:00] I think I know what you're talking about, but I don't know what it's called.
Chuck Carpenter: [07:04] Yeah, so it's like one of those bottles kind of like squatty, fancy wood cap adorned with a horse or racehorse, it looks like. So it's like playing into all that fancy or nice kind of stuff.
Robbie Wagner: [07:18] Yeah, I think it was around 70. I want to say it was more than 50, but I know it's less than 100.
Chuck Carpenter: [07:25] Yeah. I would say if you wanted something, you know, you're having, like, friends over for a nice sip before dinner or something, I could see this being kind of cool and impressive. It's not, like, amazing, but it's not bad to have around.
Robbie Wagner: [07:41] You didn't go get Jack Daniels.
Chuck Carpenter: [07:42] No, you didn't.
Robbie Wagner: [07:43] You put a little effort in.
Chuck Carpenter: [07:44] You put a little effort in and you've got some. To me, it tastes a little different than just straight bourbon, and it's got this citrusy aspect to it, so it's kind of nice. So maybe even summary in that way. I'm giving it six tentacles. It's above average. It's not amazing.
Robbie Wagner: [08:02] Yeah.
Chuck Carpenter: [08:02] It's worth talking about, though.
Robbie Wagner: [08:03] I feel like we need to solidify our ratings more because for me, so I kind of rate in a category. So because this is a bourbon, I don't like it as much as a rye, but as far as bourbons go, I think this would be like a Seven.
Chuck Carpenter: [08:20] Okay.
Robbie Wagner: [08:20] It's pretty good for a bourbon, you know what I mean?
Chuck Carpenter: [08:23] Yeah, I can see that. Instead of like just throwing everything into the whiskey pile and saying as far as whiskey goes. Yeah, that's true. I guess it's my framing around it needs some adjustment.
Robbie Wagner: [08:35] Yeah.
Chuck Carpenter: [08:36] Okay. In that sense, I probably would bump it up a little bit then thinking about other bourbons that I like, I think it would have a bit more diversity. Okay. I can agree with that. Seven it is. Seven for bourbons.
Robbie Wagner: [08:50] Yeah, sounds good.
Chuck Carpenter: [08:51] Cool.
Robbie Wagner: [08:52] Yeah. On a related whiskey note, I guess no one can see what we're doing, but I have all of these Sagamore samples.
Chuck Carpenter: [09:00] All of these meaning three.
Robbie Wagner: [09:01] Well, three. Yeah, whatever. But yeah, it's not like I'm trying 100, but basically, we went in order of Darkness just because I was thinking, like, the darker one would be the most intense. And we ended up going with the lightest looking one because the middle one was like there was a weird tannic aftertaste that I didn't like. And then the third one, that was super dark. You could see pieces of wood floating in it. It was so dark, and it was just too much. It even had smoky scotchy notes. And when it gets out to that, I don't like that. So we went with the first one. It's sample number 79-14. I don't know what that means at all, but.
Chuck Carpenter: [09:48] It's more about, like, the barrel that it came from. And it probably would have been something like rickhouse 79, row 14, or something like that. Yeah.
Robbie Wagner: [09:58] So we have that. It's like 14h.22-e03. I don't know if you can read this, but it's like
Chuck Carpenter: [10:07] Oh, okay. There we go.
Robbie Wagner: [10:08] 80% of it is, like, high rye, and 20% is low rye. And they pick a barrel of each, I guess and mix them.
Chuck Carpenter: [10:16] Okay.
Robbie Wagner: [10:17] Their fill dates were in 2014, so it should be.
Chuck Carpenter: [10:21] Eight years.
Robbie Wagner: [10:22] I can't math. Okay. Yeah, I know. It was at least seven. Like, all of them are at least seven years old.
Chuck Carpenter: [10:28] Okay. Well, that's decent. That's a sweet spot. Yeah. So I think there's some clarification here. You were having three samples of Sagamore from the barrel so that you can make a barrel selection.
Robbie Wagner: [10:40] Correct. Yes. I guess I did not lead with that.
Chuck Carpenter: [10:43] Context is everything.
Robbie Wagner: [10:45] Yeah. So we're doing a barrel pick for and we'll probably do like, one or two of these a year, I would think, depending on how well this first one goes, I guess. But for Whiskey Web and Whatnot, we are going to have, like, a branded whiskey. So this will make, I think they said I want to say if you do barrel proof, it's like, less than 200 bottles or something, but if you do, like, you water down some, you can get maybe over $200. I don't know. But we're going to do barrel proof. Keep it pure.
Chuck Carpenter: [11:13] Yeah. And then you can decide on your own, as Robbie does with a giant cube.
Robbie Wagner: [11:18] Yeah. So this will be like I don't know who's going to get it or how, because we can't just ship it to everyone because there's, like, liquor laws and whatever, but I'm kind of envisioning. We'll definitely try it live on the podcast. Whenever we get it, we'll give some to friends and family, and then the rest will go to guests or people that if we do an NFT thing at some point.
Chuck Carpenter: [11:38] Yeah, I was going to say that.
Robbie Wagner: [11:39] Yeah. We'll probably reserve, like, say we get around 200 bottles. I would reserve maybe 100. And then you have, like, a limited NFT run of 100, and they get like those. And then every time we do this, we'll reserve 100 of them for those people. Ergo we don't sell any whiskey. You bought a membership, and we just give you whiskey. So we get around some laws a little bit, I think.
Chuck Carpenter: [12:03] Yeah. They can just buy a membership for 1787. Yeah.
Robbie Wagner: [12:06] That's the exciting thing that we've been doing recently, I guess.
Chuck Carpenter: [12:10] Yeah. I mean, more importantly than your new human is the whiskey barrel. So it's good that we discuss that.
Robbie Wagner: [12:17] Well, I mean, both of them potentially make us money or lose us money. So it will be seen. Yeah.
Chuck Carpenter: [12:26] One's a longer-term investment, but yeah. So you were wanting to talk again about the bane of your existence that is monorepos. You have a hard time understanding why anyone would ever do that.
Robbie Wagner: [12:39] Yeah. Even more so now. So some backstory, and we're potentially doing this wrong a little bit in this. It's like an extreme case, right? So we have this component library, and every component is a separate package, which gets insane. If you have 100, 200 components, you have 100, 200 packages. And at some point, I'm like, okay, one of these is like a button. You could probably just bundle a few of these smaller ones as, like, general stuff. And you don't need a separate package for everything. But the way it's set up right now, everything is totally separate. And then, like, the one that I was working on needed some post-CSS stuff because what was going down the rabbit hole here, it had an image for a product, right? And we didn't want to set specific, like, 400 by 500 pixels or something. We wanted it to kind of grow to the container. But part of that, we wanted it to keep its aspect ratio. So I think it's a pretty I don't know how new, but I haven't heard of it before. There's an aspect ratio CSS property, and you can say, like, one-to-one, so it'd be like a square. Right? So we did that, and that fixed everything except for Safari because Safari did not have support for that. So the fix for that was, like, there's a post CSS plug-in, I guess you call it, that adds a polyfill for that. So it basically does what I would have done in the first place, because I actually opened a PR doing this, and they closed it in favor of aspect ratio, but whatever. The thing I would do is, like, you put a hundred percent padding on the top, basically, for, like, to save that space for the image and then move the image its height up or something like that. Right.
Chuck Carpenter: [14:33] Mhm.
Robbie Wagner: [14:34] Because the problem I guess I should say what the problem was if the image was loading, like, you have a bunch of different product images, like, say, a lipstick has, like, 20 colors, right, and you want to go through those. Then when the image was loading, that section would shrink down and then grow again as, like, you would load the image in. So we needed to stay the same size all the time. But yeah, so we fixed that with all of this stuff. And then I'm like, all right, cool. We'll use this post-CSS polyfill. It will do the thing that I was going to do until we can remove it and then just use native aspect ratio once Safari supports it. And I was like, all right, I don't know a lot about monorepos, so there's got to be a way to just build post CSS for everything, right? Like, you want to say, okay, I have these couple plugins. Like a common one would be auto prefixer or something that I just want to run for everything, right? I don't have to configure it 200 times. I just want it to run and auto-prefix all my styles I'm exporting. Not a thing. Like, please, listeners, if someone is doing that, let us know how. But from talking to Chuck and talking to some of our fellow developers that are using lots of monorepos, there's no way to do, like, a global build on everything. You have to set a build in each package and run Post CSS in each package.
Chuck Carpenter: [15:58] Yes, you can have a global config, but you are going to have to update each of the packages right, to load the global config and edit each of those separate things.
Robbie Wagner: [16:08] To find a build command.
Chuck Carpenter: [16:09] Well, I will conversely challenge you back in this and saying that why would you have a component library with 200 separate packages?
Robbie Wagner: [16:19] Well.
Chuck Carpenter: [16:19] What's the benefit of going that way? Because then I can just allow me to import just your button in my app, and that's all I ever need from you.
Robbie Wagner: [16:29] Yeah. So to me, I think it's a little bit misinformed because I think the way I would do it if I were setting it up from scratch is I would have one package as a component library, and I would rely on the framework I'm using to tree shake out the stuff I'm not using.
Chuck Carpenter: [16:44] Exactly.
Robbie Wagner: [16:46] But.
Chuck Carpenter: [16:46] I agree with that.
Robbie Wagner: [16:47] I believe because it is also used by some legacy code, which is like a Rails app, I think, and doesn't have as fancy of build tools and whatever. They're doing it this way for some tree shaking there and some flexibility to have different teams work on different packages and not have to release a new version of the whole component library or something. So they want the button team to just care about the button. Obviously, there's not a button team, but that's an example.
Chuck Carpenter: [17:17] It feels like really granular, like overly granular.
Robbie Wagner: [17:21] Yeah. The first time I saw it, I had never seen a component library where everything was a separate package. And I immediately told them, Why are you doing this? Let's not do this. But they had a couple of things that they said needed to be that way. And I forget, I think it was mostly around, like, releasing versions and like I'm trying to remember.
Chuck Carpenter: [17:43] Yeah, button version three.
Robbie Wagner: [17:44] But talk about something and let me see if I can see what they said real quick.
Chuck Carpenter: [17:48] Okay? Yeah. Because I just feel like that's hard for you to cast the idea of a monorepo as being terrible based on a very terrible use case. And offhand, that sounds what that is. The ideology behind a monorepo is like all areas of concern within the same space, right? So you're like, okay, I have apps in this monorepo and it's like all my front-end apps. And across three of those apps, there are shared there's a shared component library that's in packages, right? And then there might be some utilities that are shared across those components, a few of the apps, and maybe even like your back end, your server-side services, so you can have all your services there, all of your shared packages and all of your applications. And they're all going to use kind of their own stuff. And they would have all individual package files because the way they get to production is different for each one. And perhaps you want Lerna to say, I'm only going to release the stuff that changed. Lerna can do that for you too so that you don't do a release on the entire repository based on one package change. And I feel like that is the use case that seems to work fine for like if I want to test my app and I want to see it run end-to-end. It's nice to have everything in one repo and get all the new stuff and have one start command that goes across those workspaces or however, you organize them and then like spins up the entire app for me. Like. That I think is nice instead of like Yarn Link and the separate repo and weird stuff like that.
Robbie Wagner: [19:39] So yes and no. My biggest problem is I don't think personally it solves any problems for me. It just adds more setup and more tooling because you could write a script that's like open all of these directories and run Yarn Link and run Yarn Start or whatever. That's what Lerna is doing behind the scenes. They're just faking it.
Chuck Carpenter: [20:06] Yeah, I mean, they're like Yarn current working directory flags, blah, blah, blah command.
Robbie Wagner: [20:12] Yeah, I guess one of the potential nice things, and again, I have limited exposure to this. I don't know if I'm just spouting nonsense, but we have things to find in the root package JSON so you could have like, everything should use Autoprefixer 10 ten or whatever, and then you don't have to define that in every package. So that saves a little bit of work. But then again, if it were just one package with all the components, you would have that as well.
Chuck Carpenter: [20:41] Right. Then it's like an organizational procedure, right? In a way, sort of like I can actually have this little space on its own that does work on its own when I needed to, but then also when I need everything together, it's all together.
Robbie Wagner: [20:54] I feel like it's kind of similar to the way people are using like TypeScript right now. So it's like, if your app needs it and fits the use case, you absolutely should do it. The same with monorepos. But a lot of people are just doing it to do it. They're like, oh, monorepos are like what everyone does. Like, Ember is doing this now. Their new add-on format is monorepos. And I'm like, why? I don't need a separate app for tests. I don't need a separate app for all this other stuff. If I ever want to Yarn link it to a thing and like, test out an add-on, I can never do it again because it is a monorepo. I have to release a new version. There's probably a way to do it, but mortals like myself have no idea how to do it.
Chuck Carpenter: [21:38] Yeah, you're very adverse to following trends, and I think that there's good practice in saying why.
Chuck Carpenter: [21:46] Right, that's the point. But that's what I'm saying. I don't think everything should always be one way and everything should never be one way. I think that you kind of just use the best tool for the job when you kind of come across that.
Robbie Wagner: [22:01] Just to set the record straight here, there are cases where a monorepo could work and be good for people. I'm not saying they suck all the time. It's my argument with everything. People use React, they think it's cool. People use TypeScript because they think it's the hotness. We need to type everything. Monorepos are cool because some guys said, hey, these are cool. If it's not solving a real problem for you, just remove that from your code. You don't need that.
Chuck Carpenter: [22:26] Yeah, I mean, Facebook kind of started this, didn't they? Because all of their stuff is in one repo. Everything, all of Facebook, everything ever is in one repo kind of thing.
Robbie Wagner: [22:36] Oh, God, is it really? That's terrible.
Chuck Carpenter: [22:39] I think so, yeah. I think that's been the big thing. Like, oh, no, they just do the PHP, the JavaScript, everything.
Robbie Wagner: [22:48] I don't know if anyone ever used them. I think I only heard bad things about it, but I don't even know the terminology. Like, Git subrepos or something. You know what I'm talking about?
Chuck Carpenter: [22:58] Submodules.
Robbie Wagner: [22:59] Yeah. Everyone was like, you should never use this. It's terrible. Causes all these problems. You should split your stuff up because you don't want everyone from every team committing to the same repo. And now we've gone the other way and been like, no, yeah, put everything in the same repo.
Chuck Carpenter: [23:14] As long as it's a different toolset that I made, then you should do it. Yeah.
Robbie Wagner: [23:18] So it's just everything goes back and forth.
Chuck Carpenter: [23:22] Yeah. Some modules was almost like linking or something in some way. Yeah, I remember briefly having, I don't know, crossover with that, and I didn't really get it.
Robbie Wagner: [23:31] I don't remember what project it was, but I know I wanted that for something and I went, oh, submodules. And then I read about it and everything I could find on it, everyone said, don't use this, avoid it as much as you can, and I said, okay, I won't.
Chuck Carpenter: [23:44] That's fine. Well, see, if you're listening to the crowd, the crowd says you want hooks and you want function components and you want monorepos.
Robbie Wagner: [23:53] If Ember goes to function components.
Chuck Carpenter: [23:56] You're out.
Robbie Wagner: [23:56] I'm just stopping all JavaScript development. I'm doing only vanilla JavaScript in classes. Maybe web components, I don't know.
Chuck Carpenter: [24:04] Do any of the new players on the scene use, I guess not really, right? Remix is React, I'm sure.
Robbie Wagner: [24:11] Use classes, you mean?
Chuck Carpenter: [24:13] Yeah, they use classes.
Robbie Wagner: [24:15] No, no one does. But they will because it'll go cyclical in like, three or four years. Someone will go, oh, my God. Functional is so dumb. Why do you guys suck? Use classes. Everyone will be like, yeah, those are oh, my God. And it's like, okay, I told you this like, ten years ago. Cool.
Chuck Carpenter: [24:30] But Eric Elliott said, class is bad, don't do and I guess everybody started listening to him eventually. Remember him having those, like, massive debates about it?
Robbie Wagner: [24:43] We just need our voices to be louder. And then I will be like, hey, everyone doing what you're doing. Please stop. Everyone should look at how it's so much nicer to not do that.
Chuck Carpenter: [24:55] Well, when we get rich from bootleg and whiskey, we can start a campaign around that.
Robbie Wagner: [25:01] Yeah, I'll just do, like, conference talks and I'll submit stuff that people would actually want to hear, like the benefits of the monorepo, and write it up nicely. And then I'll get up there and be like, you guys know what is fucking terrible? Monorepos.
Chuck Carpenter: [25:14] Monorepos. Has anyone ever done a bait-and-switch like that on a talk? I wonder. That would be amazing.
Robbie Wagner: [25:20] I don't know. But I could be the first.
Chuck Carpenter: [25:23] Yeah, and it'll be like your last talk ever.
Robbie Wagner: [25:25] Yeah, it would be really hard after that. Submit a thing, people would be like, no, I remember that thing you did. A you going to do this again?
Chuck Carpenter: [25:34] Wait a minute, isn't this the thing you've been podcasting about hating? Why are you on board now?
Robbie Wagner: [25:39] No, that's another guy. That's not me.
Chuck Carpenter: [25:42] No, this is Robert Wagner. Not Robbie?
Robbie Wagner: [25:45] Yeah. I don't know that guy.
Chuck Carpenter: [25:48] That's some other Ember guy.
Robbie Wagner: [25:50] Yeah. So to circle back, it's been a few minutes now, but the use case was they said, imagine team A and Team B use C one, C two, and C three components, and then assuming it's one package and released like a major version was released with only C two having a breaking change. Imagine the teams working on the other, like C one and C three don't have the bandwidth to address the breaking change that was introduced in, like, the release of the whole package. I don't think it's a real thing. That would be a problem, but that's what they're concerned about.
Chuck Carpenter: [26:31] I mean, I guess it's very considerate, but it is a very narrow use case. And also like in open source that scenario happens all the time. And that is the nature of not writing your own stuff. That's the cost of convenience, I think. So I don't know about that. Right. And so they want to release each individual component. It just feels like a maintenance nightmare internally. Think it's worth it to you for that purpose? I guess if you're an internal tools team and that's all you have to do, maybe that's fine.
Robbie Wagner: [27:04] Yeah. The thing is, we're basically building everything you would need for the legacy app and the new app in the component library. So everyone is kind of only working on the component library and then we glue it together and yeah, I don't fully understand the legacy app, so there's probably reasons behind things, but I just complain when things aren't how I want.
Chuck Carpenter: [27:25] Right. I don't know that they've tied it in all that well with that explanation, though. Like, imagine a world where teams A, B, and C are working on buttons. One of those buttons is breaking. What do they do? Coming soon to a theater near you. Like, really?
Robbie Wagner: [27:47] Yeah.
Chuck Carpenter: [27:47] I don't know. Just don't update to the next major version of the package, I guess until you have the bandwidth to address C two.
Robbie Wagner: [27:54] Correct. Yes.
Chuck Carpenter: [27:55] Yeah. But hey, everybody has their own way of doing things. When we release our NFT, we don't have to worry about these problems anymore. I'm going to release one.
Robbie Wagner: [28:06] We can retire after that.
Chuck Carpenter: [28:07] A one-of-one NFT of each component. If you want the whole component library, it's going to cost you 200 Ethereum for the whole thing.
Robbie Wagner: [28:18] Wow.
Chuck Carpenter: [28:19] Yeah.
Robbie Wagner: [28:20] So I guess that leads us into what I had briefly mentioned to you earlier, that those that have been paying attention, we have talked a little bit about how I made Chuck buy some Shiba Inu and it tanked.
Chuck Carpenter: [28:34] Yeah.
Robbie Wagner: [28:35] But I have a couple of Shaboshi NFTs and they took a snapshot of like I think there were only 3500 owners of, like, the 10,000. So a lot of people have a bunch of them, I guess. Okay, but 2000 of those 3500 were whitelisted as, like, you can buy land in this special Shaboshi zone because they're doing like, a metaverse thing, and I was picked for that. So sometime in the next, hopefully, a couple of weeks, I will be bidding on some land and exclusive Shaboshi metaverse. I'm wasting more money.
Chuck Carpenter: [29:12] Exactly. Think about that. They've created demand in exclusivity to give them more money. For what? So that you can further entrench yourself into this club? I don't know. Yeah, I've kind of put, like, my following and then my time investment and all of this stuff kind of on a little pause like, yeah, Shiba Inu sucks right now. I don't know. I'm just going to leave it there. If one day it ends up being better, cool. If not, I'm not going to. Worry about it too much. These NFTs, like I've got the sovereign dungeon and they showed my engine and I guess some stuff is going to happen later. I don't really know. I think it's supposed to be a game like, that's my character in the game and so they're going to kick off the game down the line. That's what I thought was kind of cool about that. And then I have the recur pass. But I mean this past just lets me buy other stuff from them, right? I haven't gotten anything out of this past. This past has qualities and traits that have amounted to dick. All it meant was I have a pass. It doesn't look like this other pass, but we both get to just buy some stuff from them.
Robbie Wagner: [30:19] So there are actual benefits. But I think to the layman who's not going to spend all day figuring out what's worth what, it's not that beneficial. From what I read in like a couple of seconds, I read some of their emails. It basically allowed you to like for the college basketball stuff, they have like a pack of I don't know how many, let's say like ten basketball cards, whatever. Yeah, if you had the pass, you got to buy them early and you were guaranteed like a rare case or something.
Chuck Carpenter: [30:51] Although those rares.
Robbie Wagner: [30:53] It's different from the general public.
Chuck Carpenter: [30:55] Yeah, but you have to be ready to go too. I remember getting the email, click the button, and the rares were gone like 30 minutes after that email came. It was like and so for the regular person like me who has a life and doesn't check their email every 2 seconds and isn't like waiting, maybe we should just write bots to buy the shit, the second thing pops up, maybe that would be easier.
Robbie Wagner: [31:21] Yeah, people do that. But then you might end up with a lot of stuff you don't want.
Chuck Carpenter: [31:26] Yeah, exactly. So I don't know, it's hard to say, but I think I still believe in the utility of the technology. I do believe that there is something there and people are just going to keep getting more clever in the way that they apply that and there'll be more security down the line and stuff. But yeah, there's just way too many rug pulls these days to really make it all worth something.
Robbie Wagner: [31:50] I am curious about assume you're back in whenever baseball cards were invented, right, there was probably one company that had them for a little bit and there were probably a lot of companies that were like, wow, people like this. And then a lot of those probably ceased to exist. Right. So you're kind of in the same pool right now. Everyone's like, hey, I don't know which one is going to be like a Mickey Mantle rookie card. So we're going to buy everything and assume that one of them is going to be worth like 30 million dollars one day.
Chuck Carpenter: [32:18] Yeah, totally. And I mean that's. Fine.
Robbie Wagner: [32:20] Yeah. Most of them won't be.
Chuck Carpenter: [32:22] Yeah, that's really what it is. And so being a bit more, I think, mindful of what I get involved in, I think getting into a club that allows me to give them more money to own other electronic things is sort of like, I don't know, I don't care enough. Maybe if they were soccer cards, I would have been like, I'm all into it. Oh, my gosh, I'm going to buy these. I want my Ronaldo card. And you know what? Maybe that's just what it is.
Robbie Wagner: [32:49] You suddenly became a redneck when you wanted to buy those?
Chuck Carpenter: [32:53] Yes. I mean, do you know a lot of soccer fans? They all sound like that.
Robbie Wagner: [32:58] Really? I would have assumed they'd be like, oh, yes, I like the football. I would like to buy these cards.
Chuck Carpenter: [33:04] Yes. Your detector of sarcasm is sq at this point.
Robbie Wagner: [33:10] Okay.
Chuck Carpenter: [33:10] Yeah, that's exactly what it meant. Perhaps if I would have been able to buy a pack of cars, I want to collect the cars, right? I want the NFTs of cars. I want certain additions of cars, things that I'm actually interested in. Maybe that's what I'm waiting for. Maybe there's that. Because I do still have the recur pass and not selling it. I just haven't participated. I haven't been excited about the offerings thus far. So it's probably subjective.
Robbie Wagner: [33:36] Most of these, they're just fun. Like, maybe it'll be worth something because imagine the pass eventually gets you access to a thing that's actually worth money. Right. There's a finite amount of these things, and they're worth, like, $100,000. And you get the first bid in them. Then all of a sudden, the pass becomes worth 20 grand just to get a chance at these things.
Chuck Carpenter: [34:01] Yeah, it'll be cool if the pass gets you a chance to buy like only pass holders get to buy tickets to this event or something. I want to see Chris Rock come and do stand up here and I want to buy a smack in order to get a chance.
Robbie Wagner: [34:19] Yeah. I don't know if you were reading the tweets about that a little bit, but the best one was like, why did Will Smith use an open hand when he hit him?
Chuck Carpenter: [34:31] Because paper beats rock. Yeah, it was great.
Robbie Wagner: [34:35] I loved that. I was so smart.
Chuck Carpenter: [34:38] Yeah. I had to look up some I was, like, morbidly curious about what was going to go on there and was it for real or whatever else.
Robbie Wagner: [34:45] Yeah. I still think aside from him potentially losing his Oscar, that it was a publicity stunt for everyone involved.
Chuck Carpenter: [34:54] I don't know. I don't think he'll lose the Oscar. I think that the effort applied to gain the artistic recognition exists. I think that he won't be allowed to attend for a while, things like that. I mean, there's got to be some repercussions. You can't just. Why I don't think it's staged is because of the danger it starts to present to other comedians now. Right. Like you're basically saying that's an okay thing to do if you don't like what the comedian says to you. If you get ripped on by the comedian and they make fun of the audience all the time, it's like kind of part of it. Then you get to hit though, and you can't really normalize that.
Robbie Wagner: [35:38] Yeah, I don't want to go too far down this rabbit hole because I try to stay not super political on this podcast.
Chuck Carpenter: [35:45] It's not politics. It's just.
Robbie Wagner: [35:47] No, no let me say I was going to say I think there will be a day where all comedy is not allowed because all comedy is at the expense of someone.
Chuck Carpenter: [35:58] Yeah.
Robbie Wagner: [35:59] So like if we're going to say you can't make fun of XYZ people, then if you walk into a room and be like, hey, your shirt is dumb or something, you just made fun of that person. They don't like that. So eventually I don't know how it's going to be a business, like one day.
Chuck Carpenter: [36:20] Yeah, I think it's under threat. I mean, stuff with Chappelle too, right? Same thing. Kind of threatening the ability to criticize and sometimes criticisms you don't agree with or you don't like. And that's fine. But that's freedom of speech, isn't it? Like even if somebody says something you don't like, it doesn't mean they can't say it.
Chuck Carpenter: [36:42] Yeah. I mean, that's why Netflix like stood behind everything he did. Because we don't necessarily agree with what he did, but we are going to keep it up and he can say what he wants.
Chuck Carpenter: [36:55] That's very whatnoty? Serious whatnot? Stay tuned again for serious whatnot. Our spinoff podcast. It's almost like a contradiction there, right? Like serious whatnot? Serious random bullshit.
Robbie Wagner: [37:11] Yeah. Today on serious whatnot?
Chuck Carpenter: [37:16] When I drove La, like last month, I started listening to this podcast called Darknet Diaries. And it's kind of like so my wife watches and listens to a bunch of true crime and murder podcasts and all that stuff. And it's kind of like the nerd version of that stuff. So it's like all these crazy internet crimes and stuff and the stuff going on in the darknet and whatever. It's very interesting. Highly recommended. It's also like very privacy-focused too. It's sort of like all these crazy things happen if you don't protect your privacy. Oh my gosh. Why am I protecting my privacy more? The only thing I've done thus far is get an RFID wallet. RFID protecting wallet. So people can't steal my credit card by walking next to me.
Robbie Wagner: [38:01] Just don't have a touch credit card.
Chuck Carpenter: [38:03] Apparently by a certain date, one of the companies announced that by 2025, Mastercard will no longer have a magnetic stripe. So it doesn't matter.
Robbie Wagner: [38:12] Yeah, that's what we need.
Chuck Carpenter: [38:14] Yeah. Anyway, that was my whatnoty thing and plug for Darknet Diaries. I'm sure he listens to this one. So I'll be very excited to hear.
Robbie Wagner: [38:24] Yeah, I feel like I had several whatnoty things, but I guess one of them I should hopefully be getting my truck next week. Finally.
Chuck Carpenter: [38:33] Wow. Yes. I forgot that thing existed, kind of.
Robbie Wagner: [38:36] I know, right?
Chuck Carpenter: [38:38] Your 60s truck that you bought and almost never drove because it had to basically get rebuilt. Perfect.
Robbie Wagner: [38:46] Yeah. And what was ironic is when I went to I bought like, a vintage-looking radio that has, like, Bluetooth and stuff. And so I took that to them to get it installed, and they showed me around all of their stuff they've been working on, and they have a ton of stuff in there. And there was one that this guy had paid like 200 grand for, a Viper, I think, or something.
Chuck Carpenter: [39:12] Okay.
Robbie Wagner: [39:12] And I don't know anything about it. I just saw that he was like, yeah, we offered this bubble treatment. And I was like, what is the bubble treatment? They basically put it in this giant inflatable bubble and circulate air in it.
Chuck Carpenter: [39:25] Okay.
Robbie Wagner: [39:26] And I'm like, okay, so one, why does it keep it from getting dusty? Or like, I don't really understand. But then also, wouldn't you drive it outside at least once or twice and it would get some dust on it? And he was like, no, this guy will never drive this outside. Like, it will be in the garage all the time. And I'm like, okay, well, I guess that settles that then.
Chuck Carpenter: [39:48] He just has it.
Robbie Wagner: [39:50] Yeah.
Chuck Carpenter: [39:50] I'm really opposed to trophies, but anyway.
Robbie Wagner: [39:52] Well, yeah, I mean, buy a car you like, right, and spend as much as you want on it, but then also enjoy it. Don't just look at it.
Chuck Carpenter: [39:59] It wasn't built to sit in a bubble.
Robbie Wagner: [40:02] No, right? Yeah, but I guess I got off on a tangent on that. So, like, next to the bubble they were telling me about, like, yeah, we're doing all these builds now where we just take the base of, like, a Corvette, right, and just, like, drop the chassis on it. So you take all the old shit out and you just be like, all right, new car, but, like, old chassis. And I was like, with all that I've spent on my truck, why didn't we just do that? This would have been so much faster and a better end result. But it is what it is.
Chuck Carpenter: [40:35] They're mechanics, not salespeople. You don't know what you want. I don't know what to say. So is this place in Middleburgh?
Robbie Wagner: [40:42] No, they're in Chantilly.
Chuck Carpenter: [40:43] You have to share the name of this place. I'm very intrigued.
Robbie Wagner: [40:46] I can plug them. I mean, okay. It's ProSpeed Autoworks.
Chuck Carpenter: [40:51] ProSpeed Autoworks. Okay.
Robbie Wagner: [40:56] And they do good work. It's not like they were scamming me, but I think you are a little bit right in like. I was like, fix these ten things. They're not going to suggest an alternative that's like, rip out these ten things and put in something else they're going to fix the ten things. So yeah, that's kind of how I got there.
Chuck Carpenter: [41:16] They can't be faulted. They can't be faulted for you told them you gave them a punch list of ten things and they were like, great, we'll do that. Yeah, they weren't thinking ahead of, well, what about a brand-new undercar? I have seen that before, though. You basically get a whole new car internally and then it has the look of a 67 Camaro or whatever it is. Right.
Robbie Wagner: [41:40] I think a lot of people probably want what I did. They want it to be authentically, feel the same as when it came off the factory floor, just like replace it with new versions of those things. But I don't care that much. I like the way it looks. You can go ahead and just rip everything out. Like I don't care.
Chuck Carpenter: [41:59] Yeah, you can have some creature comforts or whatever. You're fine with that. Well, now you've learned for your next truck.
Robbie Wagner: [42:04] Yeah.
Chuck Carpenter: [42:07] Because now you've maintained the historical relevance of that truck and probably more valuable in the way that you did. So if you decide to go down a different path, you're like, okay, right now I know I can do this other thing. Bubble treatment is very interesting in the realm of cars. So when I went to La. One of the things I did was go to the Peterson Automotive Museum in La. Very cool place. I've been there a couple of times before and they're always changing cars and stuff, but I took their vault tour. So you get to go down in the vault a bunch of stuff that they're storing and see all kinds of crazy cars. Like they actually had Saddam Hussein's armored Mercedes limo, weird stuff like that. Cars that have been in movies like Ecto One and the Batmobile stuff and things like that. Some interesting Porsche and some race cars and stuff. We were lucky enough, they were like ending a supercar exhibit and bringing some of the cars down. Or there's lots of people around La. That have private collections that they'll loan stuff to or store there in the Peterson. And there was an Enzo Ferrari that they drove down into the vaults while we were there. It was amazing. Sounded incredible. Like just nuts. F1 race car with that cool red and, recommended. The Peterson Automotive Museum. I'm working on my voice career. I could pivot.
Robbie Wagner: [43:32] We'll do voiceovers instead of coding.
Chuck Carpenter: [43:35] Yeah, if celebrities would stop taking all the good voice jobs in cartoons, that would be great for the rest of us.
Robbie Wagner: [43:42] You're going to be in Secret Life of Pets 3, you know? Yeah, because didn't like Patton Oswald take over that main character from Louis C. K. He got me too'd from the first one. Louis CK. Was in the first one and I think Patton Oswald ended up having to take over for the second.
Robbie Wagner: [43:58] Yeah, I know. He was in it. I know Patton Oswalt was in it, but I don't remember who Louis CK was in that.
Chuck Carpenter: [44:06] In the first one. Louis CK. Was the main little dog and like, the big dog was really trying to take over. Yeah.
Robbie Wagner: [44:13] Interesting.
Chuck Carpenter: [44:13] Yeah.
Robbie Wagner: [44:14] So he definitely got replaced then. Yeah, it's not.
Chuck Carpenter: [44:19] So let me ask you, am I canceled? He was. Answer yes.
Robbie Wagner: [44:24] Which you know we could probably get Will Smith to come on here now because he can't do any acting anymore.
Chuck Carpenter: [44:30] I think he needs to do anything for the rest of his life.
Robbie Wagner: [44:33] Yeah, true. He can just ride around on his big yacht and do whatever.
Chuck Carpenter: [44:37] Right. Big willystyle, whatever that is. Just whatever it is. That's what he can do. Yeah. I don't know. We'll see where that all goes.
Robbie Wagner: [44:46] Yeah. Speaking of which, have you watched his new show, like Bel Air or whatever?
Chuck Carpenter: [44:54] No, I am not interested in the dramatization of the Fresh Prince. I liked that show as a kid because it was funny. Right. And you're losing all of those aspects. So, like, turning into a serious story. I really thought it was like an SNL parody when I saw that at first. So, you know, I take my entertainment very seriously. I've been on another binge run of Hot Ones lately. I'm just really. I don't know. I find that show very satisfying.
Robbie Wagner: [45:22] But you won't watch a drama.
Chuck Carpenter: [45:24] I mean, we'll watch some dramas. I just don't want to watch, like, that drama.
Robbie Wagner: [45:28] True.
Chuck Carpenter: [45:29] Yeah. I just thought it was a parody and so I just can't take it seriously. But I know what I'm getting with hot ones. I know I'm going to laugh. He's actually a pretty good interviewer, too. And then putting people under duress, going through those sauces seems pretty interesting. It's kind of funny. I think I'm inspired to try and do like, a Hot Ones party. I have some people overdo the ten wings I actually found online. You can get the sauce. There's like a company where they curate season ten sauces, and it's the ten different sauces. So as long as it includes Da' bomb, then I very much want to do this.
Robbie Wagner: [46:04] Maybe we should do a podcast. We could get everyone from Ship Shape on.
Chuck Carpenter: [46:08] Okay.
Robbie Wagner: [46:09] And we'll give them all wings and go for it.
Chuck Carpenter: [46:13] Okay. I kind of like this, actually, as also a podcast. I do still want to do it in my personal life, but I think that can be the Whiskey Web and Whatnot that is like, for one time taken over by the Hot Ones concept. And then we can just ask each other questions, like weird questions.
Robbie Wagner: [46:31] You just eat the hottest wing and then someone's like, what's type of null? And you're like, dead and you can't answer it.
Chuck Carpenter: [46:38] I don't know what you're saying. Undefined. My response is undefined currently. Yeah, you're in the wrong closure. It's not defined. Here another like geeky things. Yeah. I can be into that. I like theme parties. It used to be a funny thing that I would do when I was younger, like younger, like in my late twenties, early thirties. I had a grilled cheese party once, so I set up a bunch of griddles and stuff and I made a few soups, like your tomato soup and I don't remember, but it was like a couple of soups and then had a version that I was going to do and then invited everybody out to do some version.
Robbie Wagner: [47:20] Do a better one.
Chuck Carpenter: [47:21] Yeah, just whatever. So you had your plain craft singles on white bread version and then like fancy ones. I don't know. I remember. I think mine had like cheddar and granny smith apple slices or something like that.
Robbie Wagner: [47:35] Do you ever have those pies that would have cheddar cheese in them? Like an apple pie?
Chuck Carpenter:[47:39] Oh, yeah, in theory. Sounds weird, but they're good. Yeah, very good. It's a good mix between like the sweet and savory. I used to like fried apples a lot as a kid. I only made them once as an adult. Kind of not bad. It's a good mix there. Oh, another theme party. I had sock puppets. You bring a sock, I had a bunch of stuff and you would make your sock puppet person you made it there. So we all make our stuff together and then you had to use your sock puppet to talk the rest of the time. So anyway.
Robbie Wagner: [48:15] Sounds fun.
Chuck Carpenter: [48:16] Yeah, see theme parties. Parties are fun. And you haven't done that in quite some time, so I think hot ones can be a new theme.
Robbie Wagner: [48:24] Yeah, I haven't done anything in quite some time and probably still won't. Pandemic is kind of cooled down now, but now I have a newborn and I will not be doing anything for the foreseeable future.
Chuck Carpenter: [48:39] Yeah, you've got probably a good six months before you really kind of get to have a life again unless you have a very generous family.
Robbie Wagner: [48:48] Well, I mean, yeah, so they're kind of your typical grandparents where they'll hold him if he's calm, but if he's going to yell or throw up on them or pee or poop, he's back to us. So it's helpful in the moment. Like, I'm going to take a 30 minutes nap, you chill with them, whatever, but it's not helpful in like, I want to take a trip. They're not going to do that.
Chuck Carpenter: [49:10]Yeah. No, I get that. They're definitely not going to be like, oh yeah, we'll spend three nights with your newborn. No, they're not going to do that for sure. And that's reasonable. It's the little things right now anyway.
Robbie Wagner: [49:20] Oh yeah.
Chuck Carpenter: [49:20] Getting someone to hold the baby so you can rest. Getting people to bring you a casserole. Things are like really helpful.
Robbie Wagner: [49:28] Yeah, we made a bunch of casseroles and my parents came up like two weeks before he was born, I guess a week and a half. And we just started making like baked spaghetti, Mexican lasagna, normal lasagna, all kinds of stuff and just freezing them. And that's been really helpful because we don't have time to cook anything.
Chuck Carpenter: [49:47] No, right. And your mind is mush and everything else. It's amazing that you were able to show up for a podcast and get freed to go to the office to do a podcast.
Robbie Wagner: [49:58] No, props to Caitlin on that. She's been good watching him. And actually, in the middle of the night, she'll just change him and feed him and not wake me up to help with that. Which has been amazing.
Chuck Carpenter: [50:10] Yeah.
Robbie Wagner: [50:10] But yeah, today my one thing was I needed to watch him between three and four because Caitlin is going to take an hour nap. So I was like, all right, no problem, no problem. I'm watching him. And she's like, you also need to feed him because he ate a little bit, but she pumped some and he had more in a bottle or whatever. I was like yeah, cool. I'll feed him. And we've been trying to let him say when he's full. Yeah. So he just eats and eats and he doesn't know how to stop. So he ate until he stopped. And I was like, all right, you're full. And then he was like naked. He was wearing a diaper so I could see his stomach was like a bulb, huge. And I was like, oh shit, this is not going to be good. And we sit there like, too much. Yeah, like five minutes. And he starts being doing the throw-up. And then he throws up more than I've ever seen come out of a baby. And I was like, okay, cool. So we cleaned all that up and then he pooped right after that. And it was an eventful hour.
Chuck Carpenter: [51:14] Yeah, that's how it came, you know, like, oh, an hour. I could do that. And that could go any which way. He could fall asleep laying on your chest or he could throw up and poop everywhere. You just don't know what you're going to get.
Robbie Wagner: [51:26] But I think the things that I didn't realize we would use at all, we got this thing called a Baby Brezza. I don't know if you know what that is. And it just sanitizes bottles and stuff. And we've used that like four times a day, every day, totally. I don't know. There was so much stuff we bought ahead of time. I was like, we don't need this. What are we buying this for? And yeah, it's been interesting.
Chuck Carpenter: [51:51] Yeah. And you never really know what's effective because everyone has an opinion. Everybody's going to suggest things. But sometimes that works. Sometimes the kid hates it. Sometimes you're like, no, we don't need that. I mean, you just really never know what's going to be gold. I was going to tell you earlier and so I'll bring it up now. Speaking of things, have you heard of the peepee teepee?
Chuck Carpenter: [52:13] Yes so I knew that him peeing on me was going to be an issue. And they tell you all the different techniques of what we've been doing since the first time you pee all over me is like, take a wipe and wipe from his stomach down and get him to pee in the diaper before we take it off. But the problem is that works. But then what if he needs to pee a second time? So I've just been putting that wipe on top of him so that he'd peed into that.
Chuck Carpenter: [52:45] Right.
Robbie Wagner: [52:45] And then that's what we've been doing.
Chuck Carpenter: [52:48] Your own little peepee teepee. Yeah, I never got peed on, actually. Poop was a problem various times. Yeah, I had a lot of like, strange, crazy poop stories. Maybe I'll share some of those at a later whatnot.
Robbie Wagner: [53:03] On the Serious Whatnot podcast series.
Chuck Carpenter: [53:06] Whatnot? Don't change a poopy diaper in a small airplane bathroom on the way back home from England.
Robbie Wagner: [53:14] Yeah, there's a lot of excuse the pun, shitty diapers. I think we had the Honest brand, which we were thinking Honest is a little more organic or whatever. Like fancier.
Chuck Carpenter: [53:28] They suck. Jessica Alba selling you some stuff.
Robbie Wagner: [53:30] They suck. Do not buy those as a brand. They have good stuff, but the diapers are not good. They're like they don't seal right. And every time he would just pee out the hole, I'd be holding him and my whole shirt would just get soaked.
Chuck Carpenter: [53:46] Oh, gosh, yes. So you're like, no.
Robbie Wagner: [53:48] So stick with the Pampers or something that's actually good at stopping leaks, right?
Chuck Carpenter: [53:53] Yeah, I think we were Pampers. We are Pampers or whatever. We're almost out of that. Nice. Yeah, the Honest shampoo and lotions were good. I think we probably tried a few others.
Robbie Wagner: [54:05] Yeah, their wipes are good. And yeah, lotion, it's a good brand, but their diapers are not good.
Chuck Carpenter: [54:10] Costco, man. Costco everything. Oh my gosh. You can get like industrial wipes. Perfect. Never run out of wipes. Go to Costco. We would have done the Costco diapers, too, but we didn't really start doing Costco for baby stuff until a little later. And then Sarah was very bought into Pampers as being because she had accidents with other brands and was just like, no, I'm not. I'm good.
Robbie Wagner: [54:32] Yeah, I think that's like a scheme with the hospital because they had Pampers and they didn't leak there. And then we got home and had our diapers and they leaked all over us. And I was like, no, back to what doesn't leak.
Chuck Carpenter: [54:44] Right? Exactly. Yeah, that's true. And the hospital give you all that you want. I remember us having before, we were checking out. We were like, yeah, load up this cart for us. And then we're like, we're taking all this shit.
Robbie Wagner: [54:55] Yeah, they told us, yeah, anything you don't take from this room, we will throw away. So we were like, okay. We just took everything. We're like, you got shampoo. We're taking it. You got all the diapers and wipes were taking those like everything?
Chuck Carpenter: [55:07] Yeah, why not? Essentially, you're paying for them one way or the other kind of thing. Right.
Robbie Wagner: [55:14] Well, I mean, imagine being the new parents and you go in to change your baby and there's an already open thing of diapers. You're going to be like, oh, I don't know about, like so I get that they can't reuse them. Like that makes sense.
Chuck Carpenter: [55:29] Yeah, it's like hospital policy and being hygienic and stuff. They don't know what you touch or didn't touch and all that stuff. So it's like clear it all out. Yeah. So other than babies. I forgot an interesting thing I was going to tell you. You might be happy. Yeah. So this last couple of weeks, Sarah and I have switched cars because she drives a lot more. Taking the kids to school and back and grocery stores and whatever, she just ends up driving a lot more. And the last time she filled up our SUV, even though it was Costco, she was like a little sticker shock. And so she suggested maybe we swap cars during the week for that reason. And I'm like, oh, yeah, I want her to not be afraid of an electric car. So I start driving it and whatever. And she has enjoyed the last couple of weeks. And it's gotten a lot more comfortable with how it drives and it's torquey and that kind of stuff. But you can still drive like a normal human. On mine, you can turn the braking thing is different. It's called like.
Robbie Wagner: [56:29] Regenerative.
Chuck Carpenter: [56:29] Regenerative, yeah.
Chuck Carpenter: [56:31] Right. So normal mode doesn't have regenerative breaking on. It just coasts. But you can turn it on and off or whatever. Right. So showed her that. Now it feels more like a regular car to her. So she's pretty interested. And I don't know if we mentioned on here before, but you and I are both on the list for the Rivian when they release them to normal humans in 2028.
Robbie Wagner: [56:52] With the old price.
Chuck Carpenter: [56:54] Yes, with the old price. Thank you. Appreciate that. For sure. So, yeah, she's like, yeah, I've been driving it and getting used to it. I think I'm up for test-driving the Rivian when it becomes available now. So I think she's like buying into the whole she's thinking we might be all-electric household.
Robbie Wagner: [57:10] Nice. Yeah. So the thing for me, I don't know if you've looked into the specs on the Rivian, but all the pictures look huge. Like suburban size SUV. I know it's not that big, right? But.
Chuck Carpenter: [57:24] It's bigger than you think.
Robbie Wagner: [57:25] But they look big in the pictures, the specs, I looked it up. It's the same size as the Model X.
Chuck Carpenter: [57:32] Okay.
Robbie Wagner: [57:33] So it is tiny AF.
Chuck Carpenter: [57:35] Hmm.
Robbie Wagner: [57:36] But it's taller.
Chuck Carpenter: [57:37] Right.
Robbie Wagner:[57:38] So I'm talking about length.
Chuck Carpenter:[57:39] Really?
Robbie Wagner: [57:40] And width is the same as the Model X. Yeah.
Chuck Carpenter: [57:43] So not as big as you think.
Robbie Wagner:[57:44] I was going to.
Chuck Carpenter: [57:44] Say they were bigger than I kind of thought I've seen a truck.
Robbie Wagner: [57:47] The truck is like a Tacoma size. Yeah, not an F150 size.
Chuck Carpenter: [57:53] I'd say it's like a little beefier than the Tacoma, but about that size. Yeah, I can agree with that. And then extended cab, of course, and all that stuff. So I was kind of thinking it will be like that, but fully covered.
Robbie Wagner: [58:05] It's probably close to that. But I think we were thinking like we had a Range Rover before and it's like a smaller Range Rover Sport, to be correct. So a smaller SUV, we were thinking it was going to be bigger than that, and I think it's not really is the thing. So we're like kind of at the point where we're like, well, how is it even better than the Model X? Because that's what we have now.
Chuck Carpenter: [58:27] So I guess you'll just have to see because I think I feel like it should have more storage, essentially, the way our Q7 is like the Q7 is probably one, aside from the Model X, one of the smallest seven-seaters that you can get. So I see it as kind of like that in a way. Right. It's really well set up. Most of the time you don't need seven seats and so you get a lot of storage space. But then when you do, you have these like kids-size seats in the back and all that. So I'm kind of seeing it like that. And if I can basically have what I have now but electric, then it seems like a win.
Robbie Wagner: [59:06] Yeah, and I think they were like I was basically reading all this on Reddit, I think, and the consensus was, yes, it's kind of the same size as a Model X, but the volume is a lot higher.
Chuck Carpenter: [59:18] Right.
Robbie Wagner: [59:18] So you sit up taller. It's more like riding in a living room than a Model X is. And I like that aspect of SUVs, so I'm still interested. But I do think, like before I was very interested to the point where I would probably just buy one and not even care about test-driving it, but now I want to go see it.
Chuck Carpenter: [59:37] Yeah.
Robbie Wagner: [59:37] And see how big it is.
Chuck Carpenter: [59:39] Yeah. That was my only miss when I was in La. Because in Venice, they have a store there, apparently they at least have some sometimes there. I was like, oh, I should try and stop by, but I just packed up my day, so I didn't have a chance.
Robbie Wagner: [59:53] My dad said he saw one like the truck just driving around here. So people have them?
Chuck Carpenter: [01:00:00] Yes. I've seen one in my neighborhood. That's it so far. There's a lot in California, but so are there employees, I guess, or something? I don't know. Right.
Robbie Wagner: [01:00:07] Yeah, they sold all of the first thousand to employees or something.
Chuck Carpenter: [01:00:11] Right. Which I think it's fair. Yeah. If you helped develop this thing over the last five years of your life. Maybe you want one.
Robbie Wagner: [01:00:17] Yeah, definitely.
Chuck Carpenter: [01:00:18] And the fact that those many employees want to have it, I think that is a buyin to, like, they believe in it. Yeah.
Robbie Wagner: [01:00:26] And it gives them time to test, like, software updates and stuff before I have one.
Chuck Carpenter: [01:00:31] Right. There you go. But I think, like, the Lucid ended up winning, like, car of the year or something crazy.
Robbie Wagner: [01:00:38] Yeah. Am I remembering this wrong? I want to say they won and they were the only ones to win it without having a car or something. Since Tesla first put out a car, they exist, but people can't really buy them. So Tesla's original offering, whatever that was, I don't know if that was the Roadster, what the first car was.
Chuck Carpenter: [01:00:59] Yeah, the Roadster was their first car that came out. Interesting.
Robbie Wagner:[01:01:02] Yeah.
Chuck Carpenter: [01:01:02] Well, there's Lucids. I've seen them on the road here, and there's a store at the Scottsdale Mall.
Robbie Wagner: [01:01:09] There's one at the Tyson's Mall, but I didn't think you could get them.
Chuck Carpenter: [01:01:13] Yeah, I mean, it might be pretty limited production, but I saw one on the road not that long ago and I was like, okay.
Robbie Wagner: [01:01:21] Yeah, they have a lot better range right, on like, the higher-end ones.
Chuck Carpenter: [01:01:24] Yeah. So that's kind of their big thing is a 500 miles range. It's a decent-sized sedan. I would probably consider it like a 7 series Beamer kind of thing, kind of size. So it's definitely like a highway beast.
Robbie Wagner: [01:01:42] Yeah. I mean, that's the thing for me. Whoever can do more range is going to win because maxing out around 300 is still decent, but it won't get you but so far I want to be able to do like, a long trip where I don't have to stop and charge you know.
Chuck Carpenter: [01:01:59] Have you done any long trips yet?
Robbie Wagner: [01:02:01] Well, no, I haven't done anything because, again, pandemic and new child.
Chuck Carpenter: [01:02:05] Right.
Robbie Wagner: [01:02:05] But we will eventually.
Chuck Carpenter: [01:02:07] So, I mean, I drove out to La. And I made two stops and probably added about 40 minutes or so to my total trip. So it wasn't that bad. Yeah. I was actually pleasantly surprised with the accepted inconvenience there.
Robbie Wagner: [01:02:22] Yeah, I haven't done a trip at all yet, so I guess I can't really talk until I have. But having chargers at every Sheetz and Wawa is good for like, everywhere we would go, we would pass at least one of those.
Chuck Carpenter: [01:02:37] Is that superchargers at those?
Robbie Wagner: [01:02:40] Yeah.
Chuck Carpenter: [01:02:40] Oh, wow. And you get lifetime or just a year of free charging. What is that?
Robbie Wagner: [01:02:45] I think just a year. They got rid of the lifetime for all of for the past bunch of years. I think my dad’s was the last one. His was 2019 or 2020 maybe. So the past couple of years have not had that.
Chuck Carpenter: [01:02:59] Right. I remember when the three came out and they said, it doesn't apply to the three. And then I guess they probably just went from there. And they're supposed to open the chargers up to other cars, too.
Robbie Wagner: [01:03:09] Yeah, eventually. So once that's the thing, Rivian will also be easy to take trips with.
Chuck Carpenter: [01:03:16] Right. Exactly. Like, once you can plug in, you get the high wattage, and it's interesting, at least with a Porsche, when you first plug in, you get the highest wattage possible intake. So you go to a 350-watt charger, and it was like a whole bunch. And so for the first ten minutes, you can, like, get a lot of charge out of that and then go and then, okay, I need to get closer to 100. Well, now I got to hang out a little longer, but really, I get the same thing for a year free charging through Electrify America 30 minutes bumps. But the funny part about it is you essentially, at 30 minutes, can unplug and then plug back in and go another 30 minutes if you had to. But it's not really a thing.
Robbie Wagner: [01:03:59] Yeah, I mean, from my limited experience taking my dad's from here back to him, we stopped once to charge, and basically you get out, go to the bathroom, get some food, and by the time you're ready to go again, it's fully charged. So kind of fine.
Chuck Carpenter: [01:04:15] I rented a Tesla in England four years ago for my birthday, and we drove it all over England. It was exactly that. You were like, they have those little full rest stop things with restaurants and gas stations and all that. And that's exactly what we did. We'd, like, pull in, plug to the charger, hit the restroom, get something to eat, grab snacks for the road, come back, you're good to go.
Robbie Wagner: [01:04:38] Yeah.
Chuck Carpenter: [01:04:39] Pretty nice. This is where America is going.
Robbie Wagner: [01:04:43] We're overtime here, and people are probably tired of hearing us talk about Tesla's and stuff, but I just wanted to leave a little thing here for everyone. Please check out our next JS episode to hear from a Vercel important person.
Chuck Carpenter: [01:05:05] So, wait, are we going to talk about Vue?
Robbie Wagner: [01:05:07] We'll leave it there.
Chuck Carpenter: [01:05:08] Okay.
Robbie Wagner: [01:05:08] Yup. All about Nuxt. No. All right. Thanks, everybody, for listening. If you liked it, please subscribe. We'll catch you next time.
Chuck Carpenter: [01:05:22] Thanks for listening to Whiskey Web and Whatnot. This podcast is brought to you by Ship Shape and produced by Podcast Royale. If you liked this episode, consider sharing it with a friend or two and leave us a rating, maybe a review, as long as it's good.
Robbie Wagner: [01:05:37] You can subscribe to future episodes on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. For more info about Ship Shape and this show, check out our website at